V.O. Guy
Hello and thanks for coming along too. And we have an office doc, the digital agency podcast where we talk to agency owner, directors and learn more about what makes them tick from the things that make them similar to the things they’d rather have known sooner where they’ve had success. And where they’ve learned some hard lessons. All will be revealed. With your host, Chris Simmance, the agency coach, and he’ll be talking to a different awesome agency person in each episode, asking them four questions and seeing where the conversation takes us over the next 25 minutes. OK, so let us begin over to you.
Chris Simmance (Host)
Thanks. Voice over guy and on the podcast today we’ve got Anita from Pace Communications. Hello. Welcome on the podcast. This is the the second or third time the second or third time we’ve.
Anita Pace (Guest)
It’s great to be with you, yeah.
Chris Simmance (Host)
Tried isn’t it? Not related injuries.
Anita Pace (Guest)
Busy. Yeah. Busy Diaries and dogs to look after.
Chris Simmance (Host)
Exactly. And you’re just saying that the only day that you’ve booked the podcast on the Dogs not in the office, which the shame that hey.
Anita Pace (Guest)
Yeah, very ironic. But she’s uh, she’s actually at home today, which she’s highly unusual. But yeah, she’s not in. The office today.
Chris Simmance (Host)
So Anita, you’re the founder of Pace Communications. First things first, give us a plug. What does the agency do? What are you famous for?
Anita Pace (Guest)
And well, we describe ourselves as a Creative Communications agency, which I know is not a unique term, but we steer away from just grabbing ourselves as a digital agency. So we’re creative comms agency, what? Do we? Do we? I suppose in simple terms, create what we believe is brilliant content and campaigns that will get our clients noticed. Engage their audience at the right place and the right time, and ultimately create demand for their products and services.
Chris Simmance (Host)
And you have just celebrated a relatively large milestone birthday.
Anita Pace (Guest)
We have, so we are recording this in October and last month in September, we celebrated our 7th birthday. So yeah, seven years.
Chris Simmance (Host)
Congratulations 7. Seven years. They’ve got their agencies seven-year. If you’re gonna start a second one now running tandem.
Anita Pace (Guest)
Old thank you very much. Yeah. And I have been asked that question. We, yeah, we will see, we will see. It is exciting though because actually we have just extended the agency even further because we’ve just joined forces with a smaller agency. They’ve come under the PACE umbrella, just a a local agency. That was a team of five, so that they’ve now joined us. So we are now a team of 27.
Chris Simmance (Host)
Wow, that’s amazing. So 2027 and seven years and five of those have been essentially an M&A process which is quite exciting to.
Anita Pace (Guest)
Just last month, actually. So September was a busy month with one thing and another.
Chris Simmance (Host)
Go through. And how? How have you? And they found the kind of the merging of cultures and things like that or was it quite aligned in the first place?
Anita Pace (Guest)
And it was actually very aligned. So uh, Jess, who was the founder of the the smaller agency, she was looking at different options for her, her and her team. And she approached us and she was she was very open in the sense that we were the early agency. She was interested in joining because of our culture, and that was the thing that. Appealed to her. She felt there was a direct alignment with how we do our work and how we behave as an agency and and I agreed with her wholeheartedly when we looked at it, you know, coming together, it just made perfect sense and they’ve only been with us. Maybe I want to say three or four weeks, three and four weeks, it’s about 3. And and it feels like they’ve been with us so long, they’ve they’ve just slotted in so well and there’s been no no issues.
Chris Simmance (Host)
Ah, that’s OK. That’s great.
Anita Pace (Guest)
They just feel like part of the family, so it was a it was the right decision and it was a very quick thing as well, which I think just reinforce the fact it was the right thing to do, you know that the initial conversation through. To the completion of the deal. Just took a. Matter of weeks.
Chris Simmance (Host)
That’s brilliant. I mean that’s that’s what you want. That’s what you want in any, any kind of merger, any kind of acquisition, the Nice and SWIFT is usually nice. Obviously mind the eyes and mind the TV’s, but yeah.
Anita Pace (Guest)
Yeah, yeah.
Chris Simmance (Host)
So so over the last few years, what do you think’s been? Uh, one of the biggest successes that you’ve seen as an agency owner?
Anita Pace (Guest)
For us here at place or or just generally. In fact I I think I mean I’ve just talked about culture, but culture has been really important to me from day one and I’ve been very keen ever since we opened the doors at pace to recruit the right people. And you know, there’s been times when we perhaps have realised that for whatever reason, the people recruited out right where either the not the right fit for them or vice versa. So I think in those situations it’s quick to to address that because. Being the right fit and the right type of person and to fit into the team and complement what we’re already having, the team is is critical to the continued success of the agency. So I think having that the right people and continuing to build a creative culture is really important. And when and when I describe our culture, I talk about it as being. An environment where people can work to their, you know, natural best and feel fulfilled where they can trust each other, work together as one team. And I know it’s a bit of a cliche, but like a family. And because I fundamentally believe if you’ve got a happy team, we’re doing brilliant work and then we’re delighting our clients.
Chris Simmance (Host)
And the thing is, if it’s. If it’s, there’s lots of cultures where they say those same things, but they only mean them on paper. So it sounds like you actually live those that that culture and those values which is, which is a very different thing to having a big vinyl sign on the wall that says.
Anita Pace (Guest)
Things absolutely. And and it’s also, I mean this isn’t unique to us. I think all agencies have a similar culture in the sense that we try to have. Fun as well. So there’s a big social side to agency life, which I think has to be part of the the package because agency life is quite demanding. You know, it’s very challenging. We’re all up against deadlines, so we have to balance that with remembering to have. A good time and and celebrate the highs. You know there’s a lot of lows in agency life. You you know, win some lose some. So it’s important to take time out to celebrate the wins as.
Chris Simmance (Host)
Absolutely, absolutely agree. And I think I think living by your your, your values and your and your culture is a great way to bring new stuff in as well. Especially these days when it’s all the more expensive to find new stuff. Having a culture which your team help do your own recruiting because they’re very happy.
Anita Pace (Guest)
Yeah, absolutely. And and you know.
Chris Simmance (Host)
Happy it makes.
Anita Pace (Guest)
What we do most of our recruitment, we don’t ever use recruitment agencies, we do it through our own social channels because we’ve. Very conscious to to demonstrate, illustrate our culture through our own social channels. So we get people contacting us proactively asking, you know, do you have any opportunities or can you keep me in mind if you do have opportunities because they’ve seen what what it’s like to work at pace through our social channels. So I think that’s important as well.
Chris Simmance (Host)
So if you if. You could go back in time just as you started, uh work building the agency and give yourself like one piece of advice. What might that?
Anita Pace (Guest)
Just one piece of it.
Chris Simmance (Host)
Advice be yeah. Accumulated a lot over the years.
Anita Pace (Guest)
Yeah, I think. Agency life can be quite cruel as you know. Like I said before, when you’re celebrating the wins and obviously it’s quite a lot of lows as well. And there is a lot of rejection involved in agency life, and I’ve come from a corporate background. I worked in corporate, you know, in house for over. 20 odd years. So I think when I first started working the other side of the table, so I used to see agencies I was. The client and then I became. Obviously, the Agency so sitting on the other side of the table and I think the first time we were unsuccessful in a pitch, I took it very, very personally and I that rejection was really hard to deal with having not been. Through it before. Because I think you know, if you’re starting an agency, then you have to accept that you are going to be disappointed, but not to dwell on it and not take it personally. It’s it’s maybe just purely down to a timing thing rather than the quality of the work.
Chris Simmance (Host)
Yeah, there’s. There’s quite a lot of factors in involved, especially when it comes to that part of pitching, but you get rejection once you’ve got the client, sometimes cause you lose them once in a while and often that can hurt more because you’ve built relationships and yeah, and all sorts of things like that.
Anita Pace (Guest)
Absolutely, absolutely, yeah.
Chris Simmance (Host)
But then do you think that if you went back in time, if it was possible and? You gave yourself that advice would would would the. Uh, the just starting out. Founder of of Pace Communications, have listened to the advice.
Anita Pace (Guest)
Yeah, I don’t know because I’m, I’m. I’m quite a competitive person, but in my nature, so I think I don’t like losing and I take.
Chris Simmance (Host)
Losing a picture quite.
Anita Pace (Guest)
I think I’m just a bit more. I don’t know relaxed is the wrong word, but you know. I think what I do, what I have learned is that any feeling I have is totally my choice. So I if I choose a a different way of dealing with the situation, it’s not just about pitching, it’s about anything in life. You know, if I, I. Choose a different feeling then. I or a different thought how I how. I deal with the situation. Then that results in a different feeling. So it’s up to me. It’s like totally my choice how I want to feel about something and I think I’ve learned that you can dwell on things and, you know, make a big deal out of it or you can accept what it is and move on. And it’s easier said than done, but. I think I think that’s come with experience over the last seven years.
Chris Simmance (Host)
I think you’re right and I think, Umm, over the course of time running an agency, you learn how to deal with. Like you say, rejection, but you also it’s it’s it’s the most expensive MBA you’ll ever have, and you’ve certainly learned to be a bit stoic about things.
Anita Pace (Guest)
Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely I.
Chris Simmance (Host)
So is this something?
Anita Pace (Guest)
Wouldn’t have it any other way. I mean, sorry, just uh, just compared to my corporate life, which was very predictable. Oh, it’s so boring, but very steady. Agency life is a bit of a roller coaster, but in the same because. Of that, it’s exciting.
Chris Simmance (Host)
Oh yeah, yeah. The highs feel even more high than. Than they would. Do if they were just consistent. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely.
Anita Pace (Guest)
Yeah, yeah.
Chris Simmance (Host)
And, do you think over the over the years, do you think there’s one thing that you? You kind. Of either regret. Happening that you that you learned from quickly or is there something that you did really well as an agency and you that’s kind of something you you stuck to? The the success that that kind of rolled into like the future.
Anita Pace (Guest)
One thing, the success I mean I I know. I’ve talked about. Already, but the the culture is really important to me and I think you know, I’ve been very. Steadfast in my. Approach to the whole working from home and debate and hybrid working. So I opened it up to the team, so obviously like everybody else in the in the proper lockdown, that initial lockdown period. We worked from home as most people did, but I think after the I think it was about the first three months we started coming back to work into the office and we’ve been in the office since then and. It’s really important for us to be in the office because we know we work. Better Together and. You know, we are a company as. A clue in the name. Otherwise, we’d just be 27 freelancers, all working at home and just, you know, while I’m recording this with you in the meeting room next door, there’s over 20 of people collaborating, you know, doing ideations for clients. Now you can’t do. I don’t care what people say, you cannot do that from behind a screen in your. Living room, bedroom and. I opened it up to the team and said, you know, how do you feel about working in the office? And it was unanimous. People wanted to come into into. The office, because they enjoy being with each other. And bouncing ideas off. Each other and you. Lose. I don’t care what people say. You lose that culture if you are not altogether.
Chris Simmance (Host)
I believe you. I think there’s there’s varying different versions of the the work from home piece as well as the you know the the hybrid and all that sort of stuff and it does very much fit. Different agencies seem to have very different approaches to it based on how they work and the culture of the business. And I do think that when you’re working on an ideas based business from a creative point of view, it’s very hard to be creative. Like you say, from the side of the screen because you’re in an empty room or by yourself whilst talking.
Anita Pace (Guest)
Yeah, and you, miss?
Chris Simmance (Host)
To 10 boxes.
Anita Pace (Guest)
Yeah. And you miss those new those little conversations that happen once you, you end the team’s call. The conversation in the office is still carrying on, but you’re not part of that conversation and.
Chris Simmance (Host)
Yeah, yeah, absolutely.
Anita Pace (Guest)
Yeah. And I think, you know from a career development point of view as well, you need to be present. You need to have visibility in the office so people and you can see the contribution you’re making, which again is how. Now, I’m not saying that you know, everyone exclusively works in the office every day. People have the option to work from home one day a week if they want to, but I would say the vast majority of you know, 20 odd people are all in the office. Every. Day because they choose to be.
Chris Simmance (Host)
Yeah, and and if it’s a choice then and and people do it, then they’ve done it, right? You’ve done it right. There’s something there that makes that the case in other agencies, they, you know, may have downsized the office or something like that. And then they rotate and they try and do their do it that way. Other agencies are strictly 100% remote and they’re starting, I think based on conversations I’m having, some of which are. This is still great. Everyone loves it, but we need another five staff because we lost five. Or I think we’re gonna. We’re running out of steam, working from home and. And we need to start looking for office space and which is really interesting. It’s a lot of pivoting.
Anita Pace (Guest)
You have. To be. Yeah, yeah, I think you have to be exceptionally motivated. To work from home every day and that you know, the isolation being, I know people have calls, teams calls, etcetera, some calls, but it’s not the same as as as bouncing off each other in an office.
Chris Simmance (Host)
Yeah. Yeah, no. I I I tend, I tend to tend to agree, and I mean I I work mostly on my own most days with other agency leaders. And and I always prefer to go even if it’s a train or a plane. Uh, trip. Uh, to sit in front of them physically with them if I can, because it’s, it’s not just necessarily, uh, the presence physically and or seeing someone through a screen. It’s the the little nuances of body language that you pick up on when you’re with people that you just don’t get. You can’t see that. Properly through a screen and so I think you know being present is is, is, is, is is absolutely essential.
Anita Pace (Guest)
I’m convinced, though I’d joke about the office I’m convinced with. Obviously the energy prices and everything, everyone’s gonna go back to office in. The winter anyway. They don’t want to pay to have. The heating on at home, so they’re all.
Chris Simmance (Host)
Everyone’s gonna. I mean, there’s one good sign side of it then, isn’t there? Is, so if there’s someone who’s been listening to this podcast now and they’re thinking of starting an agency or they’ve just started an agency for themselves and they’ve got a mountain of stuff to look at doing and they they they want to listen to this podcast and work out what what, what Anita’s piece of advice? Would be what one thing and it has to be just one. One thing would you would you pick that is the that that person would come up to and say, hey, you need to. I need one piece of advice from. You give it to me now. Quick, hurry.
Anita Pace (Guest)
And so many so many, I think, I think and again it’s easy for me. To say, but I I do. I I’ve trained myself to do this is to focus on the things that you can control and not get distracted by what other people are doing. And I think when you start an agency, it’s very easy to look at what the competitors are doing, especially in your locality. And you, you could panic and think, Oh my God, we’re not doing that. We should do that. And we’re not doing that and. You get distracted. I think just. Keep that focus and just focus on what you can control and not get distracted by what those are doing.
Chris Simmance (Host)
And and how easy did you find that when? You started out of.
Anita Pace (Guest)
Interesting. Uh, not easy at all. You know, I was like I said, I was in house and I’ve seen lots of agencies. I felt there was an opportunity to do it differently and do it better I had. All these ideas about what I wanted to do. And then I’d notice agency X had run a client or agency B was offering another service, and now I think we maybe should be doing that or you know, we should go after, you know that sector or whatever it might be. And and I got, you know, it’s very easy to derail yourself off, off your plan. And I’m not suggesting you shouldn’t keep an eye on what’s happening in the market.
Anita Pace (Guest)
Because then you can start. If you do get distracted, you start to dwell on what other people are doing and you you’re not focusing on what you need to be doing, and you can only control what’s within your gift, which is what you’re doing. So yeah, the rest of it is a waste of energy and a waste. Of time. So focus on you.
Chris Simmance (Host)
And you’re never going to get. That energy back.
Anita Pace (Guest)
And your team? No, absolutely. And you’ve only got so many hours in a day. And we are all exceptionally busy, I mean. Our agency works in in media. Obviously it’s 24/7, it’s it’s constant, it’s relentless. So you’re busy enough without having the distractions of worrying what other people are doing or what other people think of. You as well. That that falls into the same advice really. Don’t worry what other people think of you, because at the end of the day. It’s again something you can’t control.
Chris Simmance (Host)
Absolutely. And I think quite every every agency leader I speak to have similar kind of opinions to you in that sense, but they also all still watch what’s going on and listen to each other and things like that and you can’t help it because it’s the, you know the, the, the, the, the, the grass is greener or looking over the fence style.
Anita Pace (Guest)
You can’t have, yeah.
Chris Simmance (Host)
Kind of thing and, but one thing I’ve one thing I’ve learned recently having launched the OMG Centre is that community is something really, really important to agency leaders in that there’s there’s enough and that you can share or learn from each other without stealing ideas or risking kind of IP and things. Like that, and sometimes that shared, shared uh conversation around the same kind of challenge or whatever, you know, someone may ask, have you had uh, I’ve, I’m having this trouble with my with a member of my staff. You can empathise and you can, you know, offer advice as part and and you’re not losing anything through that, and they’re not losing anything.
Anita Pace (Guest)
That’s good, yeah.
Chris Simmance (Host)
But they but as a you know, takes a village to, to, to, to grow an agency.
Anita Pace (Guest)
Yeah it does. It does, and I think the more confident you you are in what you’re doing, the less you are distracted by. What others are doing and great, great. That would be my bit of advice.
Chris Simmance (Host)
Next, and it is great advice, focus on what you’re good at. Focus on what you’re doing with your people and for your clients, but keep an eye on them because they might have a good idea.
Anita Pace (Guest)
Hopefully that’s helpful.
Chris Simmance (Host)
Once in a while.
Anita Pace (Guest)
Yeah, yeah.
Chris Simmance (Host)
That’s great advice to end the podcast on so. Thank you very much for coming along, Anita.
Anita Pace (Guest)
Thank you. I’ve enjoyed it.
Chris Simmance (Host)
And in our next podcast, we’ll be talking to a different agency leader to hear the lessons they’ve they’ve learned and uh, find out what happened to them along the way. Thanks for listening.