Transcript
Chris Simmance:
Hello we got here finally. In the end. Bella. Sorry everyone for being a little bit late. There were technical issues between either London or presuming Andorra.
Bella Hegarty:
I’m actually in Cheltenham, so I’m actually back in the UK.
Chris Simmance:
Ah, right. Well, that’s the problem. You’re right next to GCHQ’s head office. So they’re taking all of your bandwidth the way, listening to all of the calls. And things aren’t they? Yeah. Apologies everyone. Welcome to the webinar, Bella. Lovely to have you here. Please, please, please do a an intro. Who are you and why are you one of our favourite? OMG.
Bella Hegarty:
So I love the fact that I’m one of your favourite OG coaches, didn’t realise that was one of one of the things but.
Chris Simmance:
Yeah, ranking everyone’s at the top, basically.
Bella Hegarty:
Are perfect they. Were one of all I love that more than. Me being the favourite. I’m Bella Hegarty. I am. I call myself your client director. So I work with agencies and coaches to be able to improve their client experience. And help them streamline the internals so that they can focus on either getting back time in their agency or working on the growth that they’ve got planned without kind of that fear of losing clients not being able to streamline and handle all of the management touch points and their team to be able to kind of maintain that quality really in the agency. That they’ve worked so hard to put into.
Chris Simmance:
It and and you do this like as a. You’ve sort of come in as a third party to do that. What? What was it? That drove you in that direction in your career. How did? You get there.
Bella Hegarty:
Well, really interesting question because. I didn’t really realise that this was something that I wanted to do, just I.
Chris Simmance:
Yep, you get there sometimes.
Bella Hegarty:
Yeah, sometimes as that does happen, I actually have a background in private travel and hospitality, so high expectations, long hours. The high quality of service is something that I’m particularly used to and providing a fantastic experience because we all know that we always look back at our travel experiences and we remember the great ones. But we also remember those tiny little things, even if it’s the smallest thing that went wrong. Those stick in our memories, and I can’t remember how many. Times I’ve heard. I had the greatest time, but. Yes, since COVID I’ve lived. I lived in the. I lived in the out to the South of France and then obviously moved to Andorra as my base. And from COVID I I had to change career from working in charity cause everything shut down. I got the opportunity to work for a marketing consultancy and within that I saw how kind of working in the agency space and the digital space that. Expectations experience is something that’s still needed to be improved. There was a lot of scope creep, burnout and I experienced it a lot myself whereby with with clients on the side, I didn’t have the boundaries that I needed. Worked all hours. I find myself at the computer at 11:00 o’clock at night. Clients asking for a little bit more and a little bit more. Or would you just be able to do this or would you just be able to do that and then not knowing where the project really starts and ends with no clear? Guidelines around that and feeling like. Yeah, feeling like I had to. Always do more to make them happy. So that they. Would and often that’s not really what we need to do and actually. Through a really. Long journey of self discovery that in reality actually putting in those boundaries, setting a clear experience in place that I actually had a higher retention rate. Clients appreciated it. I’ll have a lot more and I help agencies to do the same because having worked kind of adjacent to agencies really that this was something that a lot really struggled with and actually speaking to a lot. Now I can find that. Having that opportunity to take a step back and work on the business is something that’s very difficult and I worked with the founder to help her be able to do that and it’s giving me the opportunity to see what’s necessary and what’s needed in order to get there.
Chris Simmance:
And it’s taking a step back that helps do that. And being that third party, the calm voice in the room that’s got the experience, but not necessarily having to deal with the day-to-day other issues you can, you can really get into what you get into. So today, we’re here to talk about something you’re quite, quite passionate about, something you’re quite interested in. All about obtaining and leveraging feedback. Getting it is one thing I don’t know how many agencies I’ve I’ve spoken to who’ve got big old piles of survey report results and NPS stuff. They don’t do anything with it. They’re not sure why they’ve even done it. Beyond filling in a form here and there. So I I guess, I guess the, the the. Key thing that that people who are watching this right now probably wanna know is like. What? What is the? What would you say would be like one of the core key things that it’s worth? What’s the? What’s the what’s? The the highest amount of value I. Can get out. Of the the effort that I put into this.
Bella Hegarty:
I think that. I think that what? In terms of would you say in terms of the agency or collecting the feedback?
Chris Simmance:
Yeah. So there’s there’s a finite amount of resource in the business and especially in digital agencies where everything is seemingly just as important as the other. Everyone knows they need to get feedback, whether it be from teams or whether it be from clients or whether it be suppliers and things like that. But there’s only so much that when you’ve got so much going on that you can really. Invest in these sorts of things. And yeah, so you know. What? What? What’s the kind of the? Core return on investment would you say?
Bella Hegarty:
Oh, really good question. I think it’s the clarity on what we need to do as an agency to be able to improve or what we have been doing well. There’s a list of benefits, but I think the main one is clarity on the good and the bad and by say bad. I don’t necessarily mean bad, I mean constructiveness. To be able to. Get that good. Even stronger. Because without feedback, we’re working on assumption.
Chris Simmance:
Yeah. And assumption is the mother of all.
Bella Hegarty:
100 percent, 100% I mean I can’t tell you how many.
Chris Simmance:
Let’s go, right?
Bella Hegarty:
Clients that I’ve worked. With that start, most of their stories with I think. And it’s such a. Habit without even realising that we do it. Yeah. And I think if anyone’s watching this or anyone, even even I find that I. Do it myself is. I think this is. The the right answer, but even subconsciously you don’t actually know you’re adamantly sure, and it’s looking at that feedback to help actually help identify and validate the things that we think are happy. Things are actually happening, so we know that the improvements that we make, the sales and marketing strategies that we put in place, the investments that we make within our agency that whether that’s team, whether that’s processes, whether that’s systems, whether that’s support that they are the right investment based off the feedback that we’re getting. Otherwise we’re stabbing in the dark and not really got. 100% clarity on that direction. That’s gonna get us to those results that we want, whether that’s growth, exit, whatever that might be.
Chris Simmance:
I think it’s a really good segue. You didn’t even know this was a segue coming into this, which is lovely. So on a basic level, I think that a distinction needs to be made around what is feedback, because there’s a big difference between I don’t like it and this is a this is my insight or thought around a specific subject. So what? What to you would constitute like good feedback and at its base, what isn’t feedback?
Bella Hegarty:
So I think. Understanding and feedback can come in so many ways, so it can come in the form of client wins or it can come in. The form of. And a testimonial. So whether wherever that is throughout your service when you collect that testimony, it can be really, really good. They can express the results that they’ve got the feeling that they got from working with you and that’s a really powerful one because when I talk about feedback and I can go on to the different types that we talk about, you’ve got positive, but you can also include data in there. Results the impact it’s made to them, but those emotive that emotive feedback, the description of that transformation, also is so powerful for those emotional buyers that are coming on and working with you because they are looking for that extra touch point in what else it’s been able to help as opposed to just the results side of it. And then when you’re looking at negative feedback. I don’t like to call it negative feedback. I think I’ve changed my perspective on this and I now call it constructive feedback because I think any feedback is really negative feedback. It just helps us identify those areas of improvement and their opportunities more so than. Negative areas of construction or whatever that might be.
Chris Simmance:
Yeah. And I guess it. Depends who and how they’re delivering the feedback, should we say because it’s either negative because they’re being negative or it’s negative because you’ve taken it badly. But if they’ve tried to deliver it nicely, but they’ve done a bad job of it, but they’re they’re, you know, there’s there’s no kind of malice intended. Then then it’s you that maybe is misconstruing it or deeming it as negative feedback. But like you say, any feedback realistic. Should be well, as long as it’s delivered in a nice way. Be constructive. You know there has to be a reason for delivering it rather than just saying. I think you’ve done something wrong there, mate.
Bella Hegarty:
Yeah, definitely. I mean, I think the biggest thing when it comes to feedback. Is context no? Matter what it is good, bad, whether it’s constructive, whether there’s data behind it cause. Feedback can also come in the form of data. But we’ve got to understand the context behind it to actually understand how we can interpret that feedback into something else. And that’s ultimately. What we’re trying to do, we’re not just. Kind of obtain feedback for the sake of it, because we’ve got to be able to do something with it. For it to. Be effective or mean something?
Chris Simmance:
Yeah, yeah. And and and I and I guess if you if you know what your do you do, you do, you look at data from a perspective, a similar similar sort of approach to sort of scientific method like you’ve got a reason that you want to gather feedback or do you gather feedback and then make a decision as to what to do? You know, do you do you come into it going? I really want to learn why X happens or I really want to understand how to do why and then use use the the feedback gathering to understand that or how how, what, how would you start with?
Bella Hegarty:
That’s really interesting. So without going into too much of what specifically I do with clients, we we have to really get into understanding what you’re trying to achieve. First you have to always have to start. With what you’re. Trying to achieve and and why you’re trying to. Achieve those certain things and that really helps to decide, decide. How specific areas are impacting that and that’s really you’ve got to be specific. You’ve gotta want to understand where that context is or what those certain areas are before you go into asking feedback, because otherwise general feedback doesn’t really serve yourself as the business owner, but doesn’t really serve your your agency in actually being. Able to make any change. Whereas being specific on what we’re specifically looking for. We’re able to to construct whether that’s in the form of data and actually deep dive into what that data is trying to tell us, or be more specific with the questions that we ask as to what kind of kind of feedback we’re actually trying to get from our audience, our our clients, whether that’s our clients, our audience, it could be on so many levels.
Chris Simmance:
And and and I think something that I’ve noticed. With the so. There’s a the majority of agencies, not there’s, there’s some really large ones. There’s some relatively small ones, but the majority are kind of sort of between sort of five and 15 staff, something up to 20 more or less. Most of those agencies are probably quite sophisticated with their analytics tools that they use for their clients and things like that, but it’s a little bit of. The the the Cobblers shoes type approach where you know where do I get my data from? How, where, what? What can I use? Because there’s there’s too many different ways that that you can get this in this stuff and it and it can all be very, I don’t know you, you get the right, you get the wrong answer because you put the wrong information in. So garbage in, garbage out and yeah, you know, choosing the wrong. The wrong platform might not give you the. Answers there might be a different type of scale or rating thing that actually influences what people say and stuff like that, and so at a basic level, if I was, if I was to advise an or you were to advise an agency, where should I go as a very starting point, what? What kind of platforms and tools would would be a good idea to to make sure that? What I get out of it isn’t some accidentally construed convoluted thing.
Bella Hegarty:
I think the best thing to do is start with your existing. Client base. So before you start using any kind of specific insight tools and there is some really things that you can do is looking at certain formulas whether that’s retention rates, whether that’s Net Promoter score, these are things that you can ask your clients with a simple Google. Warm Monkey survey any of these things. I’m not a huge fan of forms personally. However, it also gives clients, especially especially from my experience, American clients love to fill out forms, but also British clients will have anonymous forms because that they don’t have to put their. Name to it but.
Chris Simmance:
Right.
Bella Hegarty:
But it it I prefer to do these through things like client feedback, it’s just simple client interviews that gives us the opportunity to get contacts and you can still ask the same questions without having to. Use a form which 50% potentially may not fill out. So something as simple as a form can work. Something as simple as actually getting on the phone with them and asking them a series of questions and recording that call to make sure you get the context or using the tools that you’ve got, for example. Certain KPI’s that you’re looking to track, IE whether that’s retention, if you are looking to track retention and your retention rates are extremely low, we’ll be looking at OK, Now we can start to identify why that retention rate is so low. What do we need to do? There’s something happening. Before that phase. Of our client customer experience. To see that something is missing there. There’s a certain gap if. We’ve got a really good conversion rate and we’re we’re bringing clients in at the front end. That’s the metric that we’re looking at. There’s something in the middle of there. So where what could we identify through that and that’s kind of how we can start to look at specific data points to be able to see where or why there might not be. Why there might be an area of Provement?
Chris Simmance:
I I remember a long while. Ago we were we were looking at. If we’ve got the right clients in, why are they leaving given that they’ve got the right results and and it’s kind of turned out that through and it was through interviewing clients as opposed to like? A an objective measure scale kind of approach. Just talking to them about, you know what it is they were getting what they liked, what they didn’t like. But not doing it as a as a feedback form that we were writing the answers down, we were just having. A conversation and. We knew we wanted to ask these. Questions. It turns out that some of the clients that ended up being the ones that were leaving were the ones that felt like there was almost like they don’t. We’re not. We don’t love them enough. There wasn’t enough. They weren’t getting enough attention. So we should we say. Whereas they were getting plenty. They were getting the results. They were getting all the things they wanted, but actually they just wanted to feel like we were putting time in. To to the relationship more and things like that. And that started a whole new scenario, season of stuff that we were doing in the business around like a client love cycle. We called it, you know, every kind, every couple of weeks. We’d get in touch with them with something random, a tidbit of information. So they knew that, you know, we loved them. We promised we loved them.
Bella Hegarty:
Yeah. And it’s just and you’re right there. It’s being specific on what type of areas that you’re wanting to understand from the clients within interviews to actually understand what needs to be done.
Chris Simmance:
To improve. So. So, Bella, you’re gonna have to sell it to me. I’m an agency owner, and I I’ve got a finite amount of resources, finite amount of time. And I’m gonna do what the clients do to to me, and I’m going to say, why is it so important that I get it is? It where, where, where, would where. If I’m going to be asking clients to fill in a feedback form, anonymous or not, or I’m going to be spending time coaching my team to ask questions in. In account management calls where’s why is feedback so important for the agency? What is it? The importance here.
Bella Hegarty:
I mean, I think like we mentioned, development is a big one. So actually to be able to understand those key areas to be able to develop and improve the agency whether it’s growth or scale, we can start to understand if we are looking for big growth, what do we need to do in order to make sure that our internals can and our client experience can manage that. Whether that’s sale, investors are looking at, you’ve got a good reputation. Ultimately, if you’re getting good feedback continually that has context results, quantitative and qualitative. That’s something that they’re gonna be looking for and success. I mean, it’s gonna help you generate more revenue because. A lot of. I mean, I go and no one. Everyone, you’ve got clutch. You’ve got trust, pilot, you’ve got Google reviews. You’ve got testimonials on your website, LinkedIn, social proof. All these things are really good reasons as to why it increases your revenue. Can increase your retention referrals. All the things like. That, and it all comes from having that good client experience, and that feedback is so detrimental to be able to help us get there if it’s constructive back. It is really around development.
Chris Simmance:
And and I. Guess the the the. The converse of of that is, like you said, gut feeling. I feel like this is the right. Thing to do and. Usually that’s because you live in this little lane. Here and you can’t see anything going around here and you don’t know really what you don’t know. So your opinion is coloured by what you what you get. You know, I had a a lovely piece of feedback from someone the other day, unsolicited, saying our proposals are one of the most beautiful proposals they. Ever seen? I wasn’t asking them to buy anything from me. I was just asking them for, you know, I was sending them a proposal so they could see roughly what to expect. And it was really nice to. Have that feedback. But that’s one piece of feedback and I could have gone like this. That means our proposals never need any changes and wondering and thinking that any proposal that doesn’t convert must be. Them, not me. And now I’m looking at it, thinking when someone does sign part of our onboarding process will be what was the decision making factors in, in, in you in you agreeing to work with us, one of which may well be the proposal as a as a choice like the proposal quality of the proposal layout. Yeah. Because as soon as I started. Seeing this, the content that you put out online and some of the stuff that you talk about, I started thinking I’ve got to make sure I’m not looking down here and seeing one thing that’s coming from someone and taking that as. The gospel feedback from everything. It’s and and if you want to grow your agency, you need feedback from people around almost every single aspect of the business.
Bella Hegarty:
Yeah, 100%. I think it’s it’s so beneficial once you get that first piece of feedback, whether it’s constructive or positive one, it can give you a little ego boost and in that respect hear something positive. It’s really nice to feel that we’re doing a good job for our clients that we’re also being there for our clients and that we’re actually doing something that the market wants at the end of the day because in order to have a successful business, we’ve got to feel positive about the services that we provide. But alongside that, if it’s something that is constructive, whether they did like the proposals, but they there was things missing. Within that proposal that they didn’t feel that there were 100%. There, but everything else sold them. It opens your eyes, so yes, it may hurt, but that first feedback allows you to then look objectively at the business. So you start taking it more. So is I know what I can do and I continue to work on it as opposed to taking it so personally as an agency owner. And this is very, very common. Is that it hurt so much that you then can’t work with that client? You don’t treat them the same way because they’ve given that feedback. You don’t have the same level of appreciation from them, even if they. Are just trying to.
Speaker
First, hang out.
Chris Simmance:
Totally agree, and sometimes it’s sometimes it is. It’s painful to hear something that you don’t want to hear, but usually that’s the thing that that does move the needle somewhat. Interestingly, can, uh got a question here from Mark. He says as an agency owners put everything in to growing his this business. How do I? Approach, approach hearing and asking for constructive feedback from clients. Well, Mark, that’s actually the next slide that we’re on, so. We’re going to go through that now because I hated getting to the point where I had to ask for feedback from the team, from the clients, from suppliers because. No one likes to be. No one likes to be vulnerable and say, say something. I might not like. So when is it best to get it? And is there a best way to ask for it? Probably the nice simple. Way hopefully it will help Mark.
Bella Hegarty:
So I think when it comes to obtaining feedback, there is. It’s it’s dependent on your services would be probably. So you’ve got to have a look at identifying the different phases of the service that you offer or the product that your agency provides and always a good one for asking for positive feedback is that point of return. On investment for them. Whether that’s clarity. Right at the start of a brand strategy session. Or whether it’s when they get their first lead through from the funnel that you’ve. Set up or the 1st. The first sale that comes from an organic. Strategy things like this. So when you can actually identify where that point is and the client goes wow, this is incredible. That’s a really good point to ask for positive feedback. But there are also really small things that you can do throughout to be able to do that when it comes to negative or constructive feedback, should I say that? There are also multiple points that you can do that too in. Really subtle ways. Because leaving it to the end is often a really hard one for them to think back to all the things that happened over the time. So as you have regular touch points with your clients, it’s a really easy way to slip in and go from this first phase of the experience. Looking at the support the communication, the results that you’ve got the quality. Of the deliverable. Was there anything that you got that you didn’t that you loved, but is there anything that you got that you weren’t expecting? Or is there anything that? You expected that you didn’t receive and it can be really casually asked without a. Without a I’m asking for specific feedback because we now have with LinkedIn, with e-mail with. If you’re going into their internal systems or they’ve got a channel within your slack, for example, it can be just a simple drop of a message or alongside that. I think when you hear that. Feedback, whether it’s. Positive or negative, the first thing to do if you get positive for feedback or even constructive feedback is respond to them and. Thank them. Whatever you and and.
Chris Simmance:
And do you let’s say? Sorry to interrupt. Do you think that for if someone’s giving you feedback in that sense, then you’ve said thanks very much for the feedback whether you liked it or not, but you’ve then. Acted on it and you’ve acted on it for and it’s made a material change somewhere in the business. Would you go back to that individual and say just so you know based on? Your feedback, see here. Look what we’ve done.
Bella Hegarty:
100% because I think and I say that as I think I know from speaking to agency owners and also clients, when when this happened to me. Is that they feel really valued, part of the agency’s growth, and actually your client happiness and their relationship with you often develops and grows from that because they feel that they’ve contributed and what they feel heard and like you were saying before, it’s that feeling of feeling loved by an agency. That’s what clients really, really want is that. You’re invested in their business, you’re invested in their growth, you’re invested in their journey. But they also like to be invested in yours and feel like they’re a part of.
Chris Simmance:
Yeah, I I remember our long, our longest serving as say the clients we served for the longest and the clients we had the best relationships with were the ones that would come to our little networking drinks or would always show up at events that were other people that we had invited them to because there was a they were they were. Kind of invested in our growth as much as we they could see we’re invested in theirs and they are often the most quick to clear kind of honest feedback as well, especially when especially when directly asked or when we launched a new thing.
Bella Hegarty:
Yeah, yeah, 100. Sorry, go ahead.
Chris Simmance:
No, please. You’re the expert.
Speaker
I was going to.
Bella Hegarty:
I was going to say I think this thing really powerful in that and actually training clients to proactively feel confident, to give you feedback, whether that’s constructive or positive, because often even if we have something that was great, we forget to say something and that actually is really detrimental to your agency success.
Chris Simmance:
Yeah. And so I I I often think of getting feedback as part part and parcel of like good management of people. So if you can show that you’re capable of being vulnerable to feedback or vulnerable to something, there’s there’s a a higher degree of trust amongst a group of people, whether it be internal or external. And if that’s the case, then they’re more willing to to give their feelings their challenges, their thoughts without fear. That it will be taken out of context or treated in a bad way. And and sometimes that vulnerability goes a step away from that when it is that you get unsolicited feedback from someone that doesn’t feel that great doing the thank you so much for that. I haven’t even considered it. I am, you know, I’m looking down a tunnel here. So give it. Give me a little while and I’ll come back to you. When I’ve had a chance to really look into it. It makes a big difference. The relationship in the long run as well.
Bella Hegarty:
Yeah, definitely. I think one of the. Things that I I noticed especially. He is? I asked this to quite a lot of my clients and actually quite a lot of contacts on network Connexions that I speak to is how do you feel about giving feedback, whether it’s for a product, a service, whether it’s for anything like do you give feedback? And the people that say, yes, I’d give feedback on everything. They feel more confident to give feedback if something wasn’t right. Whereas I think the same way you did for people that don’t give feedback is they’re less likely to be able to. And I love if anyone’s already done a study on this or has seen a study on this, please let me know about it. It might be something that I do is that? They feel less. Confident to give that constructive feedback or even positive feedback through that.
Chris Simmance:
And probably at the point where those people would give give feedback the the relationship’s probably too far gone and it will be negative feedback without a reconciliation or resolution. It’s the the the straw has broken my back and now I’m off and this. Is why? Yeah. So who? Who? Who would you say like internally in a team who should be involved in kind of getting this feedback because there’s an awful lot of different moving parts in an agency and in at some agencies, you have account managers, then you have the Co managers, then you have the execs, then you have. Various different people in different departments doing different things. So who should? Be involved in kind of well getting it and then pulling it into something. Whose role would that be?
Bella Hegarty:
I think that definitely depends on the size of the agency. Obviously, the smaller you are is chances are it’s going to be you. As the agency. Owner or the? Founders obtaining this feedback, but as you start to bring in client services, managers account managers. When it comes to account managers, I think definitely the day-to-day feedback obtaining and asking for it can be really, really beneficial because they are the closest to the client. They speak to them on their basis, or if you have client services manager. They are really that strategic partner for the client. They are that liaison that I’d say confident, but it’s not really a word I like to use. It’s more that person that they can go to. Would it be your agony? Aren’t and they are liaising on behalf of that client. And so it’s really easy for them to ask for that. Feedback. In my experience, it’s actually beneficial for someone that’s slightly further away from the day-to-day of the process. The client feels that they can confide in more. So for example, if you do have a client services manager that oversees or an account manager, whether that’s your SEO manager, so that’s a little bit further away from the day-to-day process actually is able to have a slightly more objective view over everything that’s happened because they’ve not partaken in that particular project.
Speaker
Bella Hegarty:
Or role they’ve not had as much interaction with their client, so their view on the team involved the process. They’re aware of it. But they’re also be they’re also able to take that objective view and pass that on to whoever’s needs to be able to to be able to assimilate that and kind of put it into action.
Chris Simmance:
There’s kind of a A. There’s a that they’re invested and involved, but there’s less kind of day-to-day skin in the game, so it’s easier for them to listen. So the perception is sorry that that it’s easier to listen to those. People. Good question. That’s just coming from Jude is what’s important to include when asking for a testimonial from a client. What would you? Do how? I mean beyond. Just saying, hey, can you give me a testimonial? What would you include in that sort of thing?
Bella Hegarty:
So being specific about certain areas, for example, how would you describe the results, the transformation, so the feelings associated with that are really, really powerful to us. Ask the time period of when you worked with a certain agency so they worked with us on a project around X. So being specific on the type of project that it was, obviously agencies do a lot of work and a lot of different fields for a lot of different sectors. So being able to categorise those and actually identify where the results are coming from. So that other businesses or other individuals that are looking to work with the agency have context as to potentially that the service will work for them, their their situation and their needs. So the problems that you were struggling with. Potentially what’s been improved, what’s been implemented, so actually getting a little bit of understanding on the process and then the results and how has that changed and then you can kind of go into the team and the actual agency values and the community and the culture itself.
Chris Simmance:
- And and would you just as a follow on to that, cause that’s a question that I think will come up with the client I’m talking to this week actually. And would you give them would would that be, would that be something that you would potentially template to a degree and then have? In the back pocket of the right person, who would normally ask that sort of thing. So say you’ve got a few account managers, would you have a a version of this? We’d say look before you send it. Obviously nuance it to the client, but this is the this is the minimum kind of. Expectation would you do that? Something like that?
Bella Hegarty:
Yeah, I mean. I do have a template that I send through to clients that they can use and I always say feel free to to use this for yourself on going for your clients. And and that’s. Always often really powerful is just giving them a. Couple of prompts. Because people don’t really know what you’re necessarily asking them if you don’t. Yeah, but having a certain template of questions. Be beneficial to be able to have some standardisation in your testimonials, so I’ve seen a few testimonials I. This team was great. To work with. They really had a great culture and they were really easy to talk to. They were really open, honest and they had great response times. That tells me nothing about what you do, what they did. And the results that were achieved, so I have no idea whether they’re, I know they’ve got a great team and great culture and great communication. But it doesn’t tell. Me much else. So actually having. That is so.
Chris Simmance:
Powerful. And if I’m a prospective client in the future, then with respect to those lovely people who have a lovely culture and a great team, I don’t really care about that at that point. I want to know whether they can do the results and get the results and normally. You’ll end up, I I don’t know how many clients you’ve you’ve dealt with in the past that when you’re doing a pitching process, they’ve said, can we speak to some other clients please to find out what their their fee feedback is that may well be because you’ve got lots of feedback says these are nice people, not they. Do good work.
Bella Hegarty:
Yeah, definitely. I think that’s also in my experience because people don’t trust testimonials anymore. People don’t trust it.
Chris Simmance:
Not so much at home.
Bella Hegarty:
No, that you put on your website, it’s often that people see that and they say that’s great, but anyone could write that the business could write it. And I know that sounds really stupid because. Often we we. Say, well, we wouldn’t dream of doing that and yeah, but it’s so common that it actually does happen that when it comes. And bad experiences happen over and over again. I. I mean, I I I did a start. I read a study in 86% of consumers would leave a brand after as few as two negative experiences or two negative interactions and that’s so strong when it comes to actually having those right procedures in place. But hearing from a client. It gives that extra credibility and that extra social proof that you’ve got the right person, you’ve got the right bit to help you in your market, your situation and your problem to get you to where you want to be.
Chris Simmance:
Yeah, and and I and I and I guess. The the the falsification over overall is is a a minority that’s kind of caused those problems. For the majority there’s versions of it with like e-commerce companies obviously. Where you where. You can validate that that was an order number and again you can fake. That sort of. Thing we used to have. With clients, when we when when I was running the agencies, we used to have a kind of a a bank essentially of saying. If anyone needs to speak to a. Client and ask. For a testimonial, would you be happy with that kind of thing? And they, some would say yes, but by e-mail only. Others would say sure. Here’s my mobile number, that kind of thing. And that really helped us when we had those kind of we’ve seen your reviews, but anyone could write them kind of things like. Well, here’s here’s Bob’s number. Here’s Mary’s number. Or I’ll pop you an e-mail and they’ll they’ll have a conversation with you and it. And it worked really, really well because those people were, if I was in the e-mail chain as well, I was then seeing direct feedback from those people and and seeing exactly what they thought of me, even though they were talking to. Someone else, it was great.
Bella Hegarty:
Yeah, I think it is. And it’s quite surprising when they when they when. You say that to a. Prospective client and. They’re like ohh. OK. Yeah, sure. That would be great. And they actually enjoy that a hell of a lot more because it gives them that extra touch point that they know that they’re making the right decision with their investment.
Chris Simmance:
Yeah, we we as part of the OG Centre, we’ve got the, the the community on Slack at the minute. And the other only the other day someone was asking about one of the partners that we work with. There’s 46 partners, lovely people. But they were saying, are these people actually good at telecom stuff? And I was like, yeah, speak to these people and I connect them via little DM group and said speak to this person because they work with that person and then they had a chat. To to, you know, explain the situation. It’s worked out really, really well. It’s lovely to lovely to see that kind of thing happening. So yeah, the the big thing for agencies is they want to leverage everything. So every penny that comes in, they want to squeeze as much out of it and every minute that they use, they want to squeeze as. Much out of it. So how can you leverage positive impact positive feedback? How would you leverage that for success? What would you what would you do? What kind of cool little tips have you got for? I’ve got a good review. Come in or I’ve just seen some good feedback from from a client. What? What kind of cool things can we do there?
Bella Hegarty:
I think when you’ve got really good testimonials and feedback, building case studies is essential with those, especially to give good understanding of the type of businesses that you work with. When it comes to. Pitching for new business, having a case study, including that feedback. Is absolutely vital because having it in their words helps the client to be able to relate to it, but also building on that context, you’re able to talk through the process what you’ve implemented, the type of results that you’ve got for. Them I think taking small snippets and sharing those and returning those into story based content is so valuable and it’s something that I’m seeing is so much more powerful. Than just sharing a testimonial. I think the just sharing of a testimonial is getting slightly outdated because no one has the time to just read an image post or a getting good feedback post, but actually transforming that into a story. It sets the context, it sets the tone, it sets the experience of what actually happened so that people can put themselves in their their shoes and they can relate to it. Hell of a lot easier. And and then alongside that, I think when you’re working with clients and. They’re tiny wins that they get throughout different points in that journey. If you depends on what social media channels that you use, but actually just sharing small snippets is. Like, thank you so much. We’ve had an incredible week this session. The week has changed every the way I’m looking at my business. These are tiny little testimonies that if you share in certain ways, can be so, so powerful. But actually storing these is ultimately going to be great for you guys. So if you are. I think I. Was speaking to someone that has a tank page of testimonials on their website. So if a client really wanted to go and have a look, they’ve got a mixture of video written testimonials, case studies that all included in that. So everything can be accessed if needed.
Chris Simmance:
That’s nice. And I think internally there’s some good ways of leveraging those sorts of. Things as well. You know, you’ll get feedback from a client that you might see, or it might come through an account manager, but like collating that and then sharing that as like a success story in the team monthly meetings and things, it will help the people that, you know, do the work at the Colfax, should we say, actually learning that the work that they have that they see. The the the the graph and the green lines and things like that. They actually see there’s a human at the end of it going. This is great. We like this. We like these people. It really does help and and, you know, give people a good feeling and they’ll they’ll feel great forever.
Bella Hegarty:
Yeah, definitely. I think that’s one of the really powerful things where you when team members are named specifically, that’s a huge boost in team culture and morale. But everyone’s a part of the process. It’s not just one person that kind of gets all the credit. The agency’s results. They’re certain team members that really, and I’ve seen it. With a I saw it more recently with a video production agency online, and it was just a it came across a testimonial and the client actually gave specific feedback for the team that were on site that day. And you know that one that you’ve invested in a great team, but sharing that with them, they I think for me especially they it just gives an extra boost of a great working environment where everyone shows that you are a great team and you kind of work well.
Chris Simmance:
Together. Yeah. No, no doubt at all. I totally agree with you, I think. I think the the balance there is you’ve got. A balance you. Have to strike with those sorts of things, is that’s great for. The team and it’s great to feedback for you. You’ve invested in the right. Team, but in agency World Team move around every couple of years to other agencies and things like that. So when you’re looking at like if you go to a restaurant for example and you. Look at its. Reviews on online you’ll see Bob was really good. He that table really quickly. Mary was great. She looked after us when we had a problem. You go in there, you’ll not find Bob and you’ll not find Mary because they’re at a different restaurant or they’ve moved somewhere else. Yeah. So in an agency, obviously a two or three. Year lag but. Looking if you’re a cynical person and a cynical buyer, you’re gonna look through that and wonder why those names aren’t on the team page now.
Speaker
Yeah, that, that’s.
Chris Simmance:
That’s just me being a cynic and a tin foil about wearing kind of person. But you’ve got to be mindful of that when you’re thinking about getting. Using those named testimonials in pitch decks and things like that, because usually those things come just. To before or. After the meet, the team page on the on the pitch deck. If I’m being sold to, I’m gonna be a bit more cynical about those sorts of things. That’s just me, man.
Bella Hegarty:
Definitely, I think will that comes from always being reading through the assets that you’ve got and making sure you’re all your assets are up to date. There is not a testimonial that I want to see on a pitch deck that is 10 years old, necessarily if. It’s if it. Includes someone’s name that’s not in the business. I think definitely that just comes from a bit of proofreading. On the agencies part in how they pitch, but I think that.
Speaker
I have people.
Chris Simmance:
With the same. Name. They only hire people called John, that’s.
Bella Hegarty:
Probably the solution. We’re not, I’m. Not condoning it under any circumstances, but you know on the fly if if you do manage to do that and. You can introduce them in that way.
Chris Simmance:
Yeah, I mean you get into some. Record as well for that kind of thing, it’d. Be a lot of effort. There’s a there’s a lot of problems with that thing legally as well. Let’s talk to the HR team. Yeah. So first, firstly, thank you so much for all of the tips. It’s incredible amount of of information. I know that you know this. Like in your soul, so any agency leaders listening to this at the minute and you want to have a chat? And send the message in the community. Ping me a message and I’ll and I’ll connect you with Bella. There’s wonderful things that that this kind of thinking can do from an external perspective that you can’t necessarily do when you’re looking down the down the, the, the normal BAU workload. And it is so important to get good feedback. And good feedback doesn’t necessarily mean positive. Good feedback means. Quality and and if you don’t have good feedback to work from, you’re going with your gut. If you go with your gut, you’re probably gonna be wrong, because ultimately most of the time the founder or the leader of the business is wrong. They’re just the one with the the bigger ego, and they steamroll all the other things. So listen to people who. Have an opinion and factor it with some data if you need it, but you’ve been great to have on Bella and naturally I know that you’re coming back on for another few webinars in the future. We will make sure the tech works prior to being late for everyone, but thanks very much for being.
Bella Hegarty:
No, thank you so much for having me. And if I can leave you guys with the last thing is please, please, please not work on assumption and get feedback.
Chris Simmance:
Real feedback, not gut feedback. Thank you so much. Thanks everyone and see you soon.